Talk:List of known renamed ships

1st comment
For this list, shouldn't it also have the name of the ocean on which the ship appears? -- Vorky 15:50, 10 May 2007 (PDT)


 * I agree. -- Thefirstdude (t/c) 15:51, 10 May 2007 (PDT)


 * I'm curious as to what use this list has in the first place, personally. --Thunderbird 16:00, 10 May 2007 (PDT)


 * Probably none except the vanity of the owners. -- Vorky 16:01, 10 May 2007 (PDT)


 * If you want a real use for it, people could see if their ship name exists on other oceans - i.e. someone came up with it before them; also if you want to give event prize a renamed ship, but want to be able to do it on any ocean, you could look here to see if the name is already taken on some ocean. Also, I just think it's kinda cool.  Finally, I think the Greeterlang template could be used here perfectly - just put the ship name in the Pirate field - perhaps make a new template with differently-named variables and stuff.  *shrugs* -- Thefirstdude (t/c) 16:08, 10 May 2007 (PDT)
 * /vwho will always be a more accurate way to find out if a name has been used on a given ocean. This list is only useful for vanity, but since it doesn't list ship owners, it doesn't really accomplish that, either.  Vanity-named ships are permitted on pirate pages, so I suggest we just encourage people to move their custom-named ships there. --Barrister 09:51, 4 June 2007 (PDT)
 * I agree, but this list isn't doing anyone any harm as it is, is it? -- Thefirstdude (t/c) 17:24, 4 June 2007 (PDT)
 * Non-Fish, huh? I see a lot of adj-fish ships on this list. Rename the page to 'list of renamed ships' perhaps?Dopeghoti 02:16, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Does this list include ships renamed by the OMs for events or by fiat, or for whatever other reason they might've been renamed without shanghais?

Can someone add ice?
Please? I have a rename there and I can't get the ice thing to work.

if "non-fish" then why include "standard rename"?
It is possible that at one time, this page had a different name. I was originally looking for a list of all-known RENAMES (regardless of whether the renames were "standard" or "custom"). I recall adding two of my STANDARD renamed ships to that previously-existing page.

Instead of finding that old page (under the name I thought it had), I find this page instead, with my two ships listed in it. Since those two ships of mine definitely have "fish" names (i.e. they were standard renames), they should not be included in this page, so I have removed them.

However, that leaves the question: If this page is specifically for those ships having a NON-FISH name, then how can there be any standard-renamed ships herein? Many of the ships listed have an asterisk tagging them, linking to the comment/label of "Standard rename"...

Just wondering... -- Franklincain 11:17, 22 May 2012 (PDT)


 * It was moved from List of Non-Fish Ship Name. I agree that the title of the article is misleading. Perhaps we should move it to something more descriptive such as List of known renamed ships? Chupchup 12:15, 22 May 2012 (PDT)


 * Sounds good to me. Unless someone speaks up and gives a good reason for this not to be done, I intend to move (i.e. rename) this article accordingly, in the next day or so...  -- Franklincain (t/c) 00:07, 28 July 2012 (PDT)


 * I agree that this page would work better as a list of all renames, with non-standard renames noted as such. Also, do we want to note instances where (thanks to the ocean merge) two ships with the same name exist? (I mean, if you're checking to see if your desired rename is available, it doesn't matter if it's already taken twice-over or just the once.  Then again, if you're checking for availability, /vw is much, much more accurate...) --Ladodal 07:07, 28 July 2012 (PDT)

no need for duplicates on same ocean
Because of the merge, it is possible for a ship rename to exist twice on the same (post-merge) ocean. However, as this list exists to documents names that have been used, there is no need to list such a name twice in the same column. If we decide to track those names which -have- multiple incarnations, we can do that by tagging them, like with "(x2)" for example. -- Franklincain (t/c) 19:50, 29 July 2012 (PDT)

re-org as one alpha list (not by ocean)
I would like to discuss having this list re-organized into a strictly alphabetical list of ship renames, with indicators for each ship rename as to which ocean that rename is in.

Currently, this list is segregated by ocean, which means the column for Meridian stretches to a ridiculous degree, while the "column" (if it can be graced with that designator) for Ice has -just one entry-...

By re-organizing into just one alphabetical list (where the columns are alphabetical stretches of the A-Z range (as is done for the various activity lists, we present this data is a consistently more-organized (and more professional-looking) format.

Here's an example of the layout I propose:


 * Explanatory Examplefish (C,M)

This record shows the ship rename exists on Cerulean and Meridian, but not on Emerald or Ice (i.e. no "E" or "I"). Any footnote characters needed (such as "*" or "#") could be appended after the parentheses.

Thoughts? -- Franklincain (t/c) 13:46, 30 July 2012 (PDT)


 * This would be easily implemented by cloning or reusing Greeterlang. Frankly, I think we should rename that template, because it can be used for all kinds of general lists, and right now it is a single-purpose inclusion on List of greeters by language. Chupchup 17:33, 30 July 2012 (PDT)


 * Looking at the icons on List_of_greeters_by_language, I see we don't have an icon or sub-template (yet) for Ice. But there's only one renamed ship from Ice here, so far, so that's not a huge deal-breaker.  I do think we should stick with my suggestion of a text field for the ocean display, as it would take less space than the icons, and would lend itself to allowing a "count" for the case of two ships on the same ocean sharing the same rename; for ex.: using "(C2,M)" would indicate this ship name is used twice on Cerulean in addition to once on Meridian.  Appending any special footnote characters (such as "*" or "#" ) to the end of that text field would also be more consistent than mixing such tags with image icons; for ex.: " (C2,M)*" would indicate same data as before, plus that this ship name is a "standard" rename (as opposed to a custom rename).  -- Franklincain (t/c) 14:52, 7 August 2012 (PDT)

(Update): I've posted a draft of this revised version into one of my sandboxes. Presuming that no one has any objections, I intend to upload this new version in place of the old list. Thanks! -- Franklincain (t/c) 19:30, 7 August 2012 (PDT)

splitting oceans into sub-pages/templates
To make it easier to maintain and/or correct the alphabetization of the various ocean's lists, I've split off the oceans into their own template/sub-pages.

To explain how this helps, let me describe how I quickly check the alphabetization... I copy-cut-and-paste one ocean's list worth of renamed ships into a blank worksheet in MS Excel, and then use the Sort function, and then copy-cut-and-paste back into the wiki article. (Naturally, I do -not- include the HTML comments from the beginning and ending of that list into the code I'm copying out.) This uses the computer's ability to quickly and efficiently sort the text with minimal chance of error.

I've also included specific comments into this article, advising future editors which sub-page(s) they will need to look at, for any future additional renamed ships...

Thanks. -- Franklincain (t/c) 13:34, 7 August 2012 (PDT)


 * Addendum - If (or when) we decide to re-organize this list (as per the section above this one), then that re-org would negate any need for this oceanic segregation.  -- Franklincain (t/c) 13:52, 7 August 2012 (PDT)


 * I have been advised that this change may not be as helpful as I thought it would be. Therefore, I ask for the favor of your opinions on this subject, either publicly here or privately (via PM on the forums), as you prefer.  If the consensus I get is opposed to this update, then I will be happy to reverse this update I made.  (I would prefer to manually re-merge the data myself, instead of doing a simple "Revert", as I believe I've already made some minor changes to the actual data itself which may get lost in such a case.)  My apologies in advance for any imposition.  Thank you.  -- Franklincain (t/c) 15:02, 7 August 2012 (PDT)

Denoting standard renames
I agree that the templates weren't really helpful, but I'll also add that I like this new layout the best of all the ones that have recently been implemented! I would, however, like to propose switching from denoting (*) standard renames, to denoting non-standard. They're more expensive and a good deal rarer, and the vast majority of the renames I see on this list are standard. You've done a good job of adding the star to ships with names ending in things like "fish" or "bass", but "Rainbow" "Pastry" and "Gunner" are all fish names; among many, many others.

If you wanted the ships sorted (or sortable) by ocean for reasons other than ease of mechanical alphabetization, this could be done with a wiki syntax sortable table, although we'd have to think long and hard about whether or not that would be worth the resulting code complexity that novice editors would be faced with. --Ladodal 05:16, 8 August 2012 (PDT)


 * IF ;-)  we all decide we want to do this switch (from flagging Standard to instead flagging Custom renames), I've already figured out the shell game find/replace logic to make this change with no errors.  -- Franklincain (t/c) 05:26, 8 August 2012 (PDT)